Why Do Our Pinterest Marketing Efforts (promoter 2 prog.) result in 65 products via other Designers?

[CreativeLeahG]

Some time ago, I noticed that several of my Pins (not all) shared via the Promoter 2 Program, which enables me to earn a 35% affiliate fee if my item sells, do not direct customers to my product page as intended through the link I've shared. Instead, they lead to a landing page featuring my product (albeit with key details missing) along with no less than 65 products by other designers.

Example Pin: https://www.pinterest.com/pin/123215739803223742/

This offers customers numerous alternative choices to consider, in contrast to the 5+ chances they have when viewing the other designers' carousel on our product pages.

This redirection has been deeply frustrating, as it hinders the effectiveness of our marketing efforts in promoting our products. When customers end up purchasing something else, we miss out on the benefits we intended to gain from the Promoter 2 program.

To provide some context, I send approximately 20,000 customer referrals to Zazzle each month,

Total linkovers 1,360,194

which is no small effort. I've also observed that my self-referrals have dwindled from around 5+ per day to approximately 2-3 every other day.

This leads me to wonder if the redirection issue is a contributing factor, with the 65 alternative choices possibly diverting customers away from the products I've worked hard to promote and refer.

As a result, I find myself facing a dilemma. Should I consider removing all my Promoter 2 pins to prevent potential sales from being directed to other designers? Denting significantly the number of customers I send to Zazzle (linkover history). It's disheartening to put in considerable effort to showcase 65 other products without reaping any rewards in return.

Could you please shed light on whether this redirection issue is an aspect of Zazzle's or Pinterest's policy, and if it's the latter, how we might engage with Pinterest to rectify the matter? The fact that the Pins do not direct customers to the intended pages raises concerns, potentially running counter to Pinterest's terms.

Thank you for your time and consideration as I consider leaving the Promoter 2 program due to this development.

[ColsCreations]

Information on the "Landing Page" (interim 'View Product Details' page) & Referral / Affiliate Links

I included a number of links in that post to past in-depth discussions on the "landing page".  As far as the other products being shown, they're the same ones being shown as if you navigate to the main page for that product type and leave the sort on the default of Popular. That was true back in March and still held true in October.
Post from March 18,2023
Post from October 18, 2023

[klstock]

Thanks for the links, there is some good info there. I don’t delve into the forum or comment that often so have missed some of those links and discussions.

As to the landing page and the products being shown being the same as the main page for that product type, leaving the sort on Popular… the issue to me is that they are showing 65 other products on my product that I took the time to make a pin for to earn the 35% self-referral. My work, my product is being used as bait to get eyes on those 65 other products with no compensation to me.  

If Zazzle wants to direct customers to this landing page on Zazzle’s own pins and marketing efforts, great - but it should not be done on mine.  They have now made it where my potential customer has to click on an additional link just to get to my product details, and before they do that they are presented with 65 other options. My stuff is unique enough that I don’t think any of those 60 offerings under the ‘other designs in this category’ rows is going to cause the customer to choose one of those instead of mine. But they may choose one or more of those in addition to mine - and I am not compensated for that even though it was my work, my design, my pin that brought the customer there.

The other issue for me is, as many have discussed before in this forum, that Popular no longer is a reflection of what actually is Popular. Some are legitimately popular by way of earning it via actual sales. Some – probably most – are not put there because of sales or popularity.  The main page that people land on for ‘Christmas cards’ for example, under what Zazzle calls Popular Christmas Cards, there are many cards that were created only in September. Most people were not yet buying Christmas cards in September, so how would a newly created card have landed in the Most Popular category on the front page? With thousands of our pins pointed to the same landing page that shows these same ‘Popular Christmas Cards’, I would imagine they have done very well in sales now. I know if thousands of peoples’ pins took customers to a landing page where my Christmas cards were all over it that I’d do quite well too.

Seems to me we’ve all been acting as affiliates directing traffic to land on these favored designers’ products, but with no compensation or benefit to us for doing so.

[CreativeLeahG]

There is a formal complaint here which was also emailed and not even a 

'we have received your complaint' notice

https://community.zazzle.com/t5/general-zazzle-discussion/zazzle-formal-open-complaint-for-your-lega...

So it is safe to say, Zazzle don't care.

I've had a lot of private support re this from upset affiliates but it looks like little will be done without escalating and I am now in the process of escalating it.

[klstock]

I am responding to you Leah, but also it sort of morphed into a general comment….

It’s unfortunate that it came to this. You posted this thread over a month ago, and even if Zazzle employees have been busy there has been more than enough time to acknowledge and address your (and many others') concerns and questions. We have all invested a lot of time and work toward our and ultimately Zazzle's success.  

Designers are also customers, and have friends, family and co-workers who are also customers. Many are active on social media (not me, I avoid it like the plague) and word can travel fast. Such as word of disgruntled and disregarded designers, sales being significantly down for many, increased workload for decreased reward, promoting your own work only to find out that you are bringing free advertising to 65 others to benefit from with no compensation to you, etc. When that type of talk is going around about a company, it isn’t a genie that can be stuffed back in the bottle. Customers can see this stuff on complaint boards and social media and that is not a good look for Zazzle and will not inspire customers to shop on Zazzle and will discourage designers from designing on Zazzle. Zazzle needs customers and designers, without them there is no Zazzle.

We were told that doing all these cover photos and collections would lead to increased sales and promotion but many are reporting their sales have decreased instead (tons of threads about that). Promotion on my stuff seems to have stopped – on my Pinterest home feed, I used to see ‘promoted by Zazzle’ on a lot of my stuff, but haven’t seen any for awhile now. Designers are perfectly reasonable in asking questions about these issues and what the cause is (such as this landing page redirect issue), and deserve some timely and honest answers and solutions, not a dismissive attitude or being labeled ‘negative’.

[CreativeLeahG]

I hear you, my referrals are 'down' by several HUNDRED $'s a week, that's not small change and NO referrals since filing my complaint literally since the day I filed it, NO referrals. 7 days counting. Unusual for me ... yes. 

[ColsCreations]

I understand where you're coming from. I just thought I should point out those other threads so you didn't waste any more of your time trying to find a rhyme & reason to how the others are selected.

[klstock]

I appreciate that! Now I can spend that time going back through my Pinterest pins to swap out the links so that they link to my collections instead of my individual products (in order to bypass that landing page that is using my hard work to give free advertising to the same 30 or so designers across all categories that I have checked thus far). 

[Deb]

---

@klstock wrote:

I appreciate that! Now I can spend that time going back through my Pinterest pins to swap out the links so that they link to my collections instead of my individual products (in order to bypass that landing page that is using my hard work to give free advertising to the same 30 or so designers across all categories that I have checked thus far). 

---

I guess this is one way of making sure we are focusing on collections more than stand alone products - and making sure we have our products IN a collection in order to promote and get full credit .. I wonder what the future holds for collections vs shop sections and stand alone products?  Food for thought   just sayin' 😉

[ievajen]

in one previous similar discussion Zazzle said that it's done to keep visitors longer on a platform.. I see now that if it's cross sell collection then after similar designs line (which primary yours designs) comes your collection and then those other things in category

[Pixelan]

Would be great if the product link on pinterest would only show our own product we linked (makes more sense).

I spent so much time on promoting my products on social media, which in turn already promotes Zazzle for free. So the least would be to not show other creators products when promoting our own one.

[xzendor7]

I don't know how many people know this; but Pinterest will show other product pins in you post if you have certain settings turned on.

To check follow the instructions below.

Go to you Pinterest Profile.

Click on your profile icon in the upper right corner of the page

Click on Settings

On the settings page, on the left column click on "Social Permissions"

Now scroll down to where it says "Shopping Recommendations"

Make sure
"Show in standard pins" is OFF

and

"Show in Idea Pins" is OFF

If these are on, then Pinterest will be showing other peoples products on your post; and based on how you may be pinning; that means other peoples Zazzle products.

Also note that this is also an option when you create Idea Pins, which is located at the bottom of the post page.

[klstock]

Why has this still received zero response after a month an a half and multiple efforts to get this addressed? 

[CreativeLeahG]

Maybe they're waiting instead for a communication from an Attorney?

[Heather]

Hi Creators - Confirming we have received your messages and your concern is under review.

[klstock]

Any updates on this? It has been another two weeks since you posted this and over two months since this thread was originally posted... 

[ColsCreations]

Haven't seen any announcements about it yet but isn't this the time of year they used to make the forums read-only for a couple weeks to give the Mods a break over the holidays? and then last year they left them open, leaving us to be on our best behavior without them. So I don't know but thinking maybe the Mods are all on that holiday break now?

[klstock]

Well, everyone knows when the holidays are and they've had the last two months to address these concerns. 

[CreativeLeahG]

No updates.

Other issues reported I've been given a date after holidays which I totally appreciate as the reality is they are unindated.

The people we communicate with re these issues are not the decision makers and its unfortunate dealing with the fall out lands on them. I do sympathise with their position as there's nothing to suggest they don't sympathise with us, they just aren't able to communicate that. 

Working as a Manager in the NHS I can relate to having a gag order on me and having to remain silent in the face of things I didn't agree with. I'm not saying that's what's going on here, but I don't presume at all that the names we are familiar with have any part to play in what's happening right now. And I want them to know that when we express our frustrations at zazzle , it is much more akin to being angry with God, it's not personal to any individuals.

I am not in P2, and I am winding down here on Zazzle. Very sadly, but I still support it and fellow Creators.

I won't be following up with this issue. It's up to those now who are more invested.

[CreativeLeahG]

I hadn't seen this before but a reply was given a LONG time ago re this 'redirect' and 'landing page' perhaps they didn't realise they were potentially contravening (in my opinion) the terms of the P2 program when they did this. Either way we now know it is intentional and not a bug.

Other threads related to this.

https://community.zazzle.com/t5/ideas-suggestions/let-pinterest-links-go-to-the-actual-product-page/...

https://community.zazzle.com/t5/general-zazzle-discussion/yikes-i-hope-what-i-m-seeing-on-the-produc...

[klstock]

I did see this a long time ago, and again recently, however the thread it was asked on was not in relation to the P2 program specifically and the explanation you posted from Scott does not address any of the concerns I (and others) have expressed.

In Scott’s response that you posted he says “if someone clicks on a listing ad on Google or wherever and they close it 10 seconds later and end up purchasing from a competitor, then we’ve failed (you and ourselves)…” and “…in certain situations we’ll be showing a different sort of page with the intention of keeping users on our website so that they’ll hopefully purchase a product from one of our creators here…”

Well, not so fast there! If someone liked what they saw enough to click on the ad, it is fair to reason that they would not abandon that interest 10 seconds later, and in fact might purchase my item and might even browse around and buy more than one thing from my store. The potential customer liked my product enough to click through – if the goal is to get the customer to make a purchase, then there should be no extra hoops or hassles, no dangling 65 other products before them, no extra links to click on in order to learn more about or find out how to purchase my product that brought them there.

My goal in doing all the extra work to promote my products is to receive the 35% self referral – not to keep users on Zazzle ‘so that they’ll hopefully purchase a product from one of our creators here’.

Zazzle should either remove the landing page or pay 15% to me if my pin/product that brought the customer there resulted in a sale to another designer.

So to me, this is in no way an accepted solution to this thread! The issue to me is in being fairly compensated, not about determining whether it was a bug or intentional. It became pretty obvious a long time ago that it was intentional!

[Photocrazy6]

I agree it was not ok with the P2 program terms. They can't say anything because they know that.

[CreativeLeahG]

Re your comment "Well, not so fast there! If someone liked what they saw enough to click on the ad, it is fair to reason that they would not abandon that interest 10 seconds later, and in fact might purchase my item and might even browse around and buy more than one thing from my store. The potential customer liked my product enough to click through –"

You're exactly right. What they have done has been detrimental not just to Zazzle but to affiliates who like me have now removed all their links and stopped sending ANY traffic to Zazzle so NO sales are being made. My Pins now I am not in P2 program do NOT have my referral attached so there remains NO incentive for me to resume sending them traffic. I have reduced my traffic numbers from several hundred to a couple of thousand daily to under 10 a day. Their actions have resulted in sellers like me with high sales and traffic to reducing our time on Zazzle from many hours daily to under an hour daily. 

All the people who benefitted from my traffic ( and in many cases I know who they are as their products due to them on boarding my niches showed up regularly under my products) will notice a reduction in sales. This not only shows the dangers of devoting your time to copying the ideas of others and then relying on them for your traffic but that if you 'rise with them, you fall with them'. Hence again my advice to creators is always to introduce their own unique niches. 

After all these years, I can't believe it has come to this, high earners being 'forced' off the platform due to not just one but many poor decisions which are not just errors of judgement but the result of intentionally diverting sales away from innovators to a chosen few who do not appear to bring anything new to the table. All of which will reflect in traffic and sales. 

As a business person, I don't argue with business doing what it needs to be a success as long as that business is transparent, ethical and in meets contractual obligations. That (in my mind) is not what we are seeing at this present time.

@Heather Please take note and pass the views expressed in the MANY threads in public and private forums to the decision makers. If something isn't working... and this is NOT working .... change is needed.

@klstock I posted the confirmation the change was intentional as the solution to highlight the post because in regards to this issue, they didn't confirm it was intentional. There has been 'nothing' said at all. We are UNLIKELY to get a response or a solution to this until they are legally obliged to do so as I suspect their advice has been 'say nothing' because it is (in my opinion) a breach of contract re P2 affiliate links. And given the other legal case, there appears to be a pattern of behavior, in that they do not act when the issue is highlighted... they wait till push comes to shove. Lessons are not being learned here. Meanwhile your idea in regards to the landing page issue to compensate based on the 15% referral is a good one.

[Windy]

Okay. Now I see that this new kind of  page is a response to the fact that many of the ADS on the Zazzle product pages were leading shoppers to other sites entirely, to buy very similar items from other retailers. I am not sure why Zazzle ever decided to run ads for competitors, but posting sixty zazzle options is apparently the Zazzle idea of how to combat the ad problem they made for themselves.