Editors Picks Taking Priority in the marketplace, in some case dominating top 7+ pages of Category

[CreativeLeahG]

I love covers, have done since they arrived - just want to make this clear before proceeding.

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I wanted to share my observation that the main pages are currently showcasing the editors' picks as a priority. To mention one category 'mugs' - I went 7 pages deep and they were almost 100% all editors picks. Covers weren't prioritized in this broad search. Though I can see covers that are also editors picks were dominant for other more niche searches.

Editors picks, followed by covers which are also Editor's picks are taking the spotlight away from most sold/popular.

I hope Zazzle can understand that this shift can be a bit disheartening, especially considering that we were previously told that factors such as sales, marketing, tags, and descriptions would play a significant role in determining our visibility on the platform. However, it now seems that even a great cover photo may not be enough to secure a prominent placement without being chosen as an Editor's pick.

One could say 'create a better design and it will be picked' ... I'm wondering what the odds are with 100,000's of products of them being seen by an Editor. I have many products that for whatever reason never see the light of day and have all but been forgotten by me too, this is one such store that despite being my favorite is neglected Storybook Invites and I am wondering what the point of adding covers would be when they still have to overcome the Editors pick hurdle?

I recognize that Zazzle's team works super hard to make the platform as user-friendly as possible and I'm sure sales are up as a result and hence I am tentatively making this suggestion:

As you are already prioritizing covers over factors like sales and popularity, could you consider not including editors' picks in that priority positioning?

I had thought we could maintain our position if we add a cover but if there is another level added to that re it being an Editor's pick, then I'm wondering if the work involved re covers will be worth it ultimately, especially as the market becomes saturated with them. I believe that it would be fairer to those of us who have earned our visibility through hard work and proven sales, rather than through the arbitrary selection of an editor.

Thank you for taking the time to read my thoughts and for all the work that you do at Zazzle. I hope that we can find a way to work together to make the platform a success for everyone.

[idraw]

@CreativeLeahG 

You made some very strong points, I agree, the possible direction this is taking is disturbing and disheartening. Also frustrating.
 About  Editors picks, it may not be a human doing the editors picks, it may instead be an algorhythm and themed promotion scenario, that’s my theory.

[CreativeLeahG]

I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

[Scott]

Not only do we have humans reviewing products, but some of them do marketplace searches and then sort by Newest. We're doing our best to look for quality content from Creators both new and old.

[CreativeLeahG]

Can we expect then that the editors picks will continue to dominate the front pages? In which case surely the filter needs to be amended as it will not perform the function the user expects. Re most 'popular'. And covers will in fact not influence marketplace position if editors picks (with covers) take priority over those? It is important we know the answers to these questions so we can focus our efforts more productively. As an example, my rabid bid to add covers can take a back seat while I try to focus on affiliate marketing.

[idraw]

@Scott Thank you Scott for the confirming reply. At another previous POD, they used an algorhythm, so it's good to have confirmation.

[PenguinPower]

From a different perspective.... editors picks and cover photos have finally allowed some of us little folks who aren't full timers, been established for years and already platinum sellers to actually get some exposure and the resultant sales... 

Thanks Zazzle for spreading the love a bit.

[CreativeLeahG]

I feel editor's picks which naturally garner more exposure (previously maybe 1-2 spots first on a page) and the vast other ways Zazzle features newcomers etc. is appropriate. For those who earned those spots from blood sweat and tears and for whom their entire livelihood depends upon it, should not have the rug pulled overnight. Especially when as noted, perviously we were promised, the hard work, self-promotion, great designs, tags, descriptions etc. would win the day. I never hit the ground running, I have spent best part of 10plus hrs a day for 10yrs to reach this level. And I am NOT suggesting anything too grevious, just 7 pages plus (I didn't look further) makes the whole idea of adding a cover to increase visibility somewhat unhelpful

I know there are Zazzlers who resent higher sellers, which baffles me. No one should resent others for earning money from their own efforts. These badges weren't given they were earned.

[PenguinPower]

I don't resent you... I just see the irony that you clearly don't in you complaining about it being difficult to get marketplace exposure... 

[CreativeLeahG]

It might say in pro guidelines we get exposure when we reach platinum, but how do you think we reached platinum? Not with a leg-up in exposure, and those levels now are out dated. I am not sure what the perks are.

Talented newcomers are definitely recognized now (in ways that didn't exist many moons ago) by Zazzle and I love seeing them in the features, the special blog Zazzle has which many feature on, the creators picks (different to editors picks) and more. it is all good and I do envy their talent, but I support it whole heartedly as anyone who knows me knows to be true.

I also do a great deal myself to boost the profiles of other designers and help them with any aspect they need help with. I am a long way from not wishing to see people succeed whatever level they are at. This is about editor's picks suddenly appearing like a sea of stars ... where did all those stars that earned their shine go? I am not even referring to myself here, as I wasn't on those top pages in many cases. It is merely a concern and something I need to know how to navigate going forward as to where to focus my efforts as I have many balls in the air. Affiliating is my current focus (and adding covers, hence wondering if I need to be doing so) and I need meanwhile to be able to download those covers.

[Mariholly]

I completely agree. You can never please all designers... The new ones will see an opportunity to stand out and the older ones will feel left behind after many good years of selling. I don't know what the middle ground could be. I believe that in the end a good design must triumph with a good positioning, sales and a good cover, all together, a good product. Being chosen as editor's pick should be a guarantee of quality and if you don't stand out, what is the object of being selected as such? Let's not kid ourselves, I don't want to offend anyone, but we all see cheap products that are created thinking that this is an "easy" business and that anyone can do it. Those of us who have been fighting for years know that it is not and those products are not going to be up there, or at least that's what I think.

[waterart]

But who's to say what a good design is? I say let the customer decide what they like and not have the editors decide for them. I'm all for editors picks but not page after page. If that's how zazzle wants it then how about making editor picks a part of the filter, then customers can decide if they only want to see editor picks and nothing else.

[Caprice]

Agree.  While EP's are usually really nice - who's to say that's every customer's cup of tea?  Regarding a filter for it - there is already one available.  Under "Special Picks" I believe.

[Caprice]

Wait.  Do we know that this is true? 😟

"As you are already prioritizing covers over factors like sales and popularity"

[idraw]

@Caprice 

From this post—-

<https://www.zazzle.com/creators/playbook/learn+about+cover+photo>
…Our site experience will now begin to favor products with Cover Photo, which includes features in our landing pages, access to special programs, as well as ranking in search. We believe the Cover Photo update will be a welcome change for customers searching for inspiration on Zazzle while at the same time, rewards Creators who put effort into their listings on the marketplace

[Caprice]

Well, right - I just figured cover photos would simply be added to algorithm...meaning sales/popularity would still matter...yet you'd be placed even higher in the search results if you HAVE a cover photo.

[Scott]

You're absolutely correct, Caprice.

[CreativeLeahG]

Is that correct? Many have noted that their top ranking items have disappeared from view in favor of covers and my searches show a field of editors picks. Am I mistaken?

[Scott]

HI CreativeDesign,

Thanks for taking the time to leave us this feedback. Happy to pass it along to the team.

Having done a few searches for mugs, funny mugs, and father’s day mugs, I also see that there’s a lot of Editors’ Picks appearing quite high. I’m not very close to the search team but I can say that their job is not easy. There’s a LOT of attributes and variables that are balanced, re-balanced, and re-balanced again throughout the year based on site performance and test results. Our marketplace search performance is vital to our health, and decisions are not made lightly.

And, Caprice is right. There's a LOT of factors, variables, and attributes that we take into account when ranking products. For example, seeing three people mention that their products have dropped in marketplace placement isn't enough information to draw conclusions from.

[CreativeLeahG]

"Seeing three people mention that their products have dropped in marketplace placement isn't enough information to draw conclusions from."   If editor's picks have gone from 2 a page to filling the entire page it is safe to say, it is more than 3 people affected, it will be everyone who filled those spots before an editors pick filled it. I went further on mugs beyond page 7 and never actually came to a page that wasn't filled with editors picks. This is quite a leap.

[savanamm]

Try typing "business cards" and you'll see first three pages with Editor's Picks ONLY, and then following pages with 80% of Editor's picks... In the first three rows on the first page from 12 designs shown, ten designs are from the same designer...  

[Tessa]

What about if editors' picks got the first 1-2 rows and were rotated out on a regular basis (daily/weekly/whatever works best after testing) rather than filling up the first 5+ pages. Or maybe the first row is a carousel and you can scroll through the editors picks? Just throwing out ideas! 🙂

[CreativeLeahG]

I like the carousel idea.

[klstock]

I like that idea a lot!

[Barbara]

I'm freshly back from doing a search, randomly typing in "birthday mugs." There were, I believe, around 8 or 10 editor's picks in the top rows, and then there were a lot of the rest, which didn't include that many mugs with covers, and those with covers were scattered through the listing.

It's possible, @CreativeLeahG , that by clicking on mugs without running a bit deeper by doing what a customer might do, which is to search for more specific mugs, you ran into what might be a flaw in the system because ALL the editor's picks bubbled to the top.

Colorwash's Home

[CreativeLeahG]

I do indeed hope that is the case.

I just did Birthday mugs and out of 60, there are 27 editor picks so close to 50% at present, this is more than I noted previously. I am concerned this could be a development we have yet to be advised of. But I am also spending far too much time in front of the screen and will probably be seeing little yellow stars while I'm asleep. I'm going to focus on affiliate marketing. I can't keep up with the changes on the storefront anymore, it's just too vast and ever-changing and for me tp say that .... that's well ... I am defeated.

Yet, I could be worrying about nothing, and I hope that's the case. 

[Barbara]

That's strange. We did the exact same search and came up with very different results. I'm shutting down now, but I'll try to remember tomorrow to do identical searches signed in and signed out in private browser mode.

Colorwash's Home

[KeegansCreation]

I ran the same search and also got 27. One was a misplaced sticker and one was a misplaced paper plate (people forget to change departments when they transfer design). 

The first product that had neither a gold star nor a cover photo (so sales alone) was at #12.

So yes, editor's picks are top spot with editor's picks with a cover photo being prioritized although the #1 spot is editor's pick/no cover photo. Spot #2 is editor's pick+photo.

I got some Saint Patrick's Day socks chosen as an editor's pick. (So I think idraw's theory that there is thematic picking going on is correct.) Yesterday, gold star and all, they were on the second page of a search for St. Patrick's Day socks. They were preceded by many St. Patrick's Day socks with neither cover photo nor gold star. Naturally I made a cover photo. This morning, they have bopped up to spot #9 on the first page of that search. They are still preceded by some no photo/no gold star socks (presumably big sellers). These socks have not yet sold. So gold star+cover photo was a far greater elevation than gold star alone.

My takeaway? Anybody with an editor's pick product(s) needs to give it a cover photo as the first priority before anything else.

[CreativeLeahG]

Scott has already confirmed Editors picks are chosen by human's

[ColsCreations]

I mentioned the other day, as an aside to a reply re cover photos, that of the first three pages (180) of wedding invites - I didn't look past that - 78% (140) of the products were flagged as Editors Picks.  That was not searching, that was navigating to the wedding invites "landing page" by using the main left menu. I just did the same for Drinkware (can't go any further to a specific type using just the main nav menu) and this time I clicked all the way to the last page 17. 60 products a page, that's 1,020 products. And as @CreativeLeahG said, the majority were all flagged as Editors Picks. If we go with 78%, that's 795 of them. This just amplifies what I felt when I saw it on the wedding invites pages, that with that many of them one after another after another it dilutes any significance they might hold for shoppers. The blurb over the badge explains "This has been selected by Zazzle Editors as a top-quality or top-selling design." Top-quality is sometimes debatable, top-selling though would be purely objective. But if we go over here to look at all-time bestsellers, only 37% of the first three pages of products are flagged as EP's. We're seeing twice as many EP's on the cat landing pages than browsing the best-seller section. EP's have run amok. 

I think EP's should have their own section with a link to it on the main nav menu and a shout-out on the home page, maybe in the "More Hand-picked, Heartfelt Gifts " section or something. Outside that I think they should come up natively, wherever they would naturally occur, then people would be like "oh, hey, this product has a gold star, I want to look at this one..." Lumping them all together page after page after page when browsing categories sort of defeats the intent to try and make them stand out as special.

Also, with Zazzle's focus on making everything more personal with a human connection, wouldn't it be more fun if instead of saying "This has been selected by Zazzle Editors as a top-quality or top-selling design" (which doesn't seem to be exactly true anyway) the blurb said things like "Marcia in Customer Service ❤️'s this mug" and "Scott in Community Relations  gives this design a 👍"  ?

[Windy]

This reminds me of what I have heard many times from people who have promoted records. They say it's impossible to pick the hits. The public decides what the public likes and it's generally a complete surprise to the promoters. So having  an avalanche of "Editors' Picks" may not result in more sales for Zazzle.

[orientcourt]

Touche' ColsCreations! I feel that Zazzle is trying to have control of how sales happen/occur . But the opposite can happen also if going down this path! Great to show cover photos, editor picks, how many have viewed this product, but the reality our customers just want to buy something they came to Zazzle for. A quick direct guide to the product! Ps They already know what they are searching for!  I still believe that Sales history of a product should take preference over other Initiatives! The bread and butter of most companies results come from the tried and true! Also the reviews of these products take a part when searching! By all means Zazzle has to promote new and potential top sellers because they are the future of the site! However I believe the customers have the  first say in what they wish to view!   Jillian designer  orientcourt  zazzle                                          

[CreativeLeahG]

There is also the lack of regard for those sellers whose sales have of course been responsible for Zazzle's significant profits, they (we) have all been shoved off to the side like we are irrelevant and this to me is crushing. 

[GL123]

I'm going to take a slightly different position here about Editor's Picks. I've had Editor's Picks in the past that never got decent placement in the marketplace, and I always wondered what was the point if the product was on some page way in. I always thought that getting an EP meant that Zazzle thought the product had good potential for sales based on their own marketing research. So for me, seeing that EPs are getting higher placement is a good thing.

That said, I appreciate everyone's take on this. At the end of the day, we're all just trying to be successful on this platform, and there are a lot of variables that go into that for sure.

[Barbara]

I did as promised yesterday and ran a comparison, searching for birthday mugs in Firefox and then in a private browser. Not much difference. This morning, I got 15 editor's picks in Firefox and 14 in the private browser. Even though the difference is very small, I wonder why there's a difference at all. And I also wonder why @CreativeLeahG saw so many more than I have. Is there a difference because of location? But why so many more editor's picks for birthday mugs in the UK? I have questions but no answers.

Colorwash's Home

[CreativeLeahG]

I counted 29 today. Keegan's Creation got same result as me yesterday too.

[Barbara]

Unless someone from Z explains why we see different screens, I'm going to blame it on weather patterns.

Colorwash's Home

[Windy]

Where's the LOL emoji when you need it!

[Westerngirl2]

It's an interesting change.

I've had EP's that never sold to a customer. Most of my top selling designs have never been picked as an "Editor's Pick". So...is our objective to accumulate EP's, or to sell products?

I think it's great to have EP's. But filling the first search pages with them is, I think, not a good direction. I agree that they should definitely carry weight. But because the editors, even though I'm sure they are talented and have good info at their fingertips, are still human, the picks are largely subjective, I would think. Customers are customers....they want what they want regardless of the "awards" the design has garnered. And those that sell well are selling well for a reason...customers like them.

JMO.

[Windy]

So true! I was just responding above to Cols that the public buys what the public wants. And even savvy well funded record promoters have NEVER been able to to "pick the hits". It's a losing game.